Writers Group

[lanky]

I know that Teck talked about wanting to start a writers group and that there are a few other writers on here, so if anybody is interested this might be cool to do.

Maybe it will work better to move it to some other location but oh well lets see.

[schiaparelli]

why were there zero posts here i'm mad.

anyways, i'm not sure what your vision for this was but perhaps we can talk about what we are currently writing and our struggles? general writerly chitchat?

i'm writing a design primer (so: how one develops design taste and technique) and the main issue i'm running into is that i'm somewhat unused to structuring nonfiction/explanatory/tutorial-esque narratives. i'm so used to writing in response to questions, like advice-community-style, when it comes to topics like this. and this sounds silly but it's weird to have to both define the question and answer it.

been trying to read more nonfiction explanatory stuff and get a feel for how to structure this stuff, and i've been practicing writing essays.

[bels]

Deadkitty is trying to write a short story for class he should upload it here we can give him con-crit.

[deadkitty]

I started today. It's really depressing

[deadkitty]

here's 1 1/2 period's worth of work:

first page is rough ideas i scribbled out in half an hour, the other is more cleaned up version

I feel like it's way too over dramatic and uses too many over the top (and shitty) metaphors, but I'm pretty lost in terms of plot/decent ideas and english teachers are generally suckers for this kind of stuff. I'll probably have the main character jump off the roof of his office building. excuse my awful handwriting

[teck]

I AM SO IN. LETS FUCKING DO THIS.

I've only written two short stories, and they're both garbage. I was a socialogy major in college so i didn't read a lot of the "classics". The last year i've been trying to read a lot of staples - hemingway, fitzgerald - and lately i've moved to reading more contemporary guys. I've been told that my writing style is too verbose so i'm reading some Raymond Carver right now.

I have a series of vignettes based on fashion on my blog (http://postmoderngentleman.com/category/fiction-2/). It's fun and it helps that its short. Interesting that actually i find the majority of fashion pics to be completely devoid of emotion. it's just pretty, skinny, young, rich people. who cares? there's no drama in them.

DEAD - i like the tempo of your writing but you're right it's basically one note. one sad guy. i actually don't know anything about how his life sucks other than him saying his life sucks. i've found with really good stories you know the characters life sucks but he never actually says it sucks or he's depressed, at least not for a little while. i dont know if that helps.

i'm very excited about this writing group

[bels]

type it up dk you lazy swine

[sknss]

or don't, your teacher might do a google search.

[deadkitty]

here it is so far. the parts that I feel like I need to change/expand on are underlined. right now it's about half the length it needs to be and I'm not sure what else to do.

you're totally right teck, I need to focus more on his actions and life rather than just saying "I'm sad." idk what depressed people really do though. whenever I've gone through anything I usually just sit in bed and don't do much and that's kinda hard to write a lot about

I dunno, I feel like the story is kinda weak atm in terms of plot, word choice, ideas etc

[odradek]

ok, so i've read this over a couple of times. first, i want to be very clear about word choice in this kind of story. teck's reading raymond carver who has a quote to the effect that "every word in a story can mean something," which is to say when cutting things this tight, everything needs to be deliberate. i'm seeing sprinkles of it but i'm not getting it overall. i see the ocean motif twice but no more (maybe 2.5 if we include sprawl, which isn't an especially oceanic word). we have intimations of suicide with the razor and the building but no more. we see the mention of the third chair, which i've got my ideas on but it feels more like chekov's un-fired gun.

we also have what appears to me to be a contradiction in the repetition of 'stop and start' and the ceaseless beating of the guy's life/dream of life. is there a bleakness without end, or is there a granularity to his misery? is it both? i think that kind of cheapens it. there's no sense of a spiraling in to an inevitable conclusion beyond your explicit stating that there is, which is boring. plus a guy whose life is miserable with nothing beyond that is pretty boring for me, the reader, to read. i'm not really getting the 'picture of depression' aspect out of it. for my money, the best i've seen was DFW's The Depressed Person: http://harpers.org/wp-content/uploads/H ... 059425.pdf

[teck]

Odradek, thanks for the link. DFW is a master.

Notice how in just the first page he sets up the depression. The main character's parents won't pay for her braces. That's it. But it's a great way to frame the depression, tying it to something rather mundane.

i like that first line about the table. How depressing is it, after all, to be sitting at a table alone that used to be meant for three? thus, just having a piece of toast can be the most agonizing thing in the world.

[charybdis]

I actually like the detail of the third chair being in the dumpster the best (along with the detail of the razor sitting in the palm of his hand). I could see where you were going but I felt like most of it was some kid imagining what depression is probably like in a "h8 corporate america, if I ever become an office drone I'll fucking kill myself" sort of way. It just seemed very mundane.

The clipped sentences are cool, but way overdone to the point of making it seem trite. I think you work so hard to telegraph that "something is not right!" when details like the razor are much more effective and subtle. I think instead of starting it off with the reader already knowing that life sucks, etc, etc, maybe approach it from the angle where the main character is trying to still believe/sell to the reader that his life is good, but the story gets more unsettling and the hints of suicide get stronger as the story goes on? If that makes any sense. (Although it might fuck with tone a bit.) Would be interesting if you added an interaction between the character and someone else. Maybe at his job?

For some reason, I was thinking about Vladimir Nabokov's "Symbols and Signs" when writing this. http://www.newyorker.com/archive/1948/0 ... _000214135

[smiles]

I would play around with getting rid of the "I' in your sentences. Makes it seem much more bleak. The 'I' is already implied right. you gotta commit to an image. and it seems like you are moving between a few different ones.

compare.

6AM. Eyes open. The same dream. turn over in bed and stare at the empty space [beside me]. Shower. Eat. two chairs and a table. the third chair in the dumpster.

idk if its better. its just different.

you tend to use unnecessary words. like outside when talking about the dumpster. where else would a dumpster be?

[smiles]

I had to write an example of ekphrasis for classical art course. I decided to make an attempt at a poem which i've never really tried (except in 5th grade or something)

i wrote about a pen. definitely could use improvement. I didnt really spend enough time on it.


a pen given to me.

the day after my birthday while lying in bed,

an apology and a gesture.

the first ‘nice’ pen given to me,

to me, who chews and mutilates and then loses

all pens in the space of one notebook.

a token of trust? [corny line]



one and a half years later i still have your pen.

of course chewed and mutilated,

black rubber scraped and metal shining through,

marks and beaver-like indentations deface the ends

which nervous teeth have found comfort in.

at times, i have gnawed and scraped in anger or disappointment

and at times i have considered losing your pen,

cruelly laying bare your fear. [corny?]

but i do not.

i have kept your pen, i refill it when it runs dry,

constantly aware of its position in my bag or pocket.



a pen given to me.

the day after my birthday while lying in bed

almost two years ago.

a pen given to me.

[UnwashedMolasses]

Is this necessarily restricted to literature? Because I'd love to get some lyrical critique.

[bels]

Well Smiles just uploaded his poem so why not.

[bels]

Smiles w/r/t your poem I'd lose the first verse and the "i have kept your pen" from "i have kept your pen, i refill it when it runs dry,"

[rjbman]

Does anyone here do NaNoWriMo? Haven't done it the past couple of years but was considering it this year.

[deadkitty]

I got A+ on my story. Thanks guys

[bels]

How about some sort of writey related game? Ideas:

* someone writes a "what's styleforum wearing" style post about a fit in the waywt thread, then nominates someone else and that person has to write about the next waywt fit? Would need a list of entrants and someone to ping people when they were nominated. I could do that.

* That was my only idea

[SisterRayVU]

I did a lot of writing a long time ago in UG and all that. Here's a poem, I dunno. Thoughts? I kind of want to get back into writing and now that this thread is bumped, maybe I'll try to get a story going and do a few paragraphs a night. http://pastebin.com/m6wjNphB

Also I really like your idea Bela. Those posts are pretty cool.

[UnwashedMolasses]

I'd be in, that could be a lot of fun.

[bels]

If yr upthumbing my orig post then I'm including you in the roster of people who'd be up for it. I reckon we need maybe two more.

[Syeknom]

I up-thumbed because I'm friendly but I'm no writer don't make me down-thumb you

[schiaparelli]

I WOULD LIKE TO DO IT BELA

[schiaparelli]

[SisterRayVU]

holy shit that's so cool

[bels]

Alright it's on like Cinnabon (what)

Here is the list of ppl:

Stingray
Schia
Not Syek
Odradek
Molasses
Sister Ray (???)
RJB
Maj
Ramseams

OK so lets get the ball rolling and therefore I nominate Schia. Schia next fit that goes up you write on. Then when you're done nominate someone. I will try to keep an up to date list. When you nominate them post here and send them a PM.

Lets keep stuff fast and fun so no more than 500 words? Type of length you can write with one coffee high.

I'm also going to put a time limit on and say you need to write something w/in 3 days of the fit appearing.

I will make a thread for this hold on.

[schiaparelli]

i'm very excited for this and i accept the challenge

keep in mind i will fictionalize this stuff heavily so sincere apologies to whoever might feel offended, but i will take all the steps necessary to ensure that it is a pleasant thing for everyone involved. i am merely taking flintstone from your fit, not interpreting your psyche/personality or whatnot. or maybe i am. who knows

NO ONE SUE ME FOR SLANDER
it would be libel, anyways

[Bobbin.Threadbare]

I want to see this happen. I'm going to post.