News/Current Events, discussion (Bullets, Ballots & Bombs)

[mc-lunar]

I will be protesting tomorrow. For clarity's sake, I don't know enough about this specific case to say whether I think the verdict was right or wrong, and I don't believe the protest organizers claim to as well. But as far as I can tell, there is absolutely a race problem in America and especially institutions such as the police force. That's what we're protesting. Black lives should matter just as much as white or asian or hispanic lives.

[nevergreen]

yes!!

[hooplah]

[diniro]

[charybdis]

Jesus fuck what is going on here.

And indictment isn't the same as a guilty verdict. They could have indicted Wilson if they wanted to but they didn't because no one gives a shit about minorities in this country unless it's convenient. They just closed the door on further investigation.

[nevergreen]

[nevergreen]

[nevergreen]

since i can't edit my posts after an hour i'm gonna keep posting information as it gets released/i see it. everyone needs to stay informed

here is proof that mike brown was 148 feet away from wilson when he was shot

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/11/2 ... lson-s-SUV

unsurpisingly to no one, wilson had prior history for being a dumb fuckin cop
and as it was never mentioned by myself nor anyone else here, wilson never even filled out a police report after he killed brown

trayvon would have been 19 today.

in case you're not up to date about the tamir rice case here's the video of the cop shooting him in less than two seconds after getting out of the car. i want to throw up i feel disgusting. ohio is open carry btw

[chadnik]

[charybdis]

[hooplah]

[diniro]

[nevergreen]

[IsaiahSchafer]

It's easy to take a side and immediately let yourself get clouded with confirmation bias. I say that to everyone, so you might nudge yourself to consider opposing views before dismissing them, to read things that you disagree with, and to try empathize with everyone- both sides.

Now, just to provide some context- the National Bar Association is not the same thing as the American Bar Association. I say this because that's the mistake I made in reading about this and it's worth knowing that they're two separate things.

National Bar Association is the oldest/largest network of predominantly african american attorneys. The American Bar Association is the one that's been around since 1878 and has almost half a million members- the one most commonly associated with lawyers and the phrase "the bar".


Next, I want to say my dad was a cop for almost 30 years- so I know a fair bit how police systems work, how investigations go, and just some general law enforcement trivia. And before you attack my father's character, I'll just say he was fired (later the mayor switched it so he was able to retire) for refusing to racially profile, for trying to stand up against office politics and "good ol boys" type of clubs and cliques, and for all around being the most decent human being I have ever known (doesn't work well when everyone else is gaming the system). So yes, there are good cops, but yes there's a bad system. Let yourselves look at people as individuals and not just labels. This was a long preamble for me to just say- eyewitness testimony is bottom tier kind of evidence. And the media attention and time that passes makes it even worse.


Sorry, one more thing- be careful with "sourced" articles. Lots of the sources send you into a recursive loop of self-references and newscaster quoting newscaster around and around, so "the facts" of this case that you "know" are real could very easily be misrepresented, misinterpreted, or completely fabricated.


All in all, let yourselves take a step back (can't see forest for the tree etc etc)

[diniro]

[eufemism]

damn that's a great sign.

[nevergreen]

[nevergreen]

the cop who killed eric garner wasn't indicted.... he was filmed choking this man to death and got off with nothing... in a city that banned chokeholds in 1993 no less!!

what the fuck are body cams gonna do when a cop is filmed choking a man and still doesn't get charged with anything?!

[Stingray Sam]

I was going to post this in the feel talk thread, however since I have an opinion on this whole situation and it semi-relates to national happens and recent events I'll post here.

Firstly my opinion on what has happened in Ferguson is this, I'm not a lawyer, I've heard evidence supporting Darren Wilson and evidence supporting Michael Brown. I think that in the end no one will truly ever know what happened or if justice was served due to the muddled mess that the media, government, Brown's supporters, Wilson's supporters and other involved parties have made the situation. What is concerning to me is the militarized police response to peaceful protests and the ignoring of the cries that injustice is occurring everywhere to minorities in America. The Eric Garner case also speaks to this and I am severely disappointed in the outcome. However these are not just isolated incidents and many people seem to be unable to see the forest for the trees when they discuss this issue.

What I feel right now is the biggest problem in America, or perhaps the root of problems in America is the lack of community that we have. To be sure we do have community in the sense that there is a black community, a Christian community, a rich community, a law enforcement community etc. However it seems to me that these communities are largely insular, and that there are no wider communities in America that reach out across the hugely varied spectrum of Americans, nor one with a sense of greater, communal, civil involvement and respect for others. I was listening to a podcast the other day that featured Michael Sandel, a Harvard political philosophy professor and author a few popular philosophy books. He claimed that the consumerism in our society has allowed for greater stratification and separation between people. The rich no longer have to interact with the poor and the poor are largely unable to interact with the rich. Though anyone is free to buy luxury items, only a select few can purchase them. So the rich sit in first class, the rich get fast passes to the front of the line, and the rich sit in sky boxes. At the same time the middle class is largely separated from this and the poor cannot even afford to participate in this sort of consumerism.

When you go to a sports event there are general lines for getting in the game and then there is a private entrance for those who have paid enough to separate themselves. Often people who have sky box passes or vip memberships to stadiums don't even have to walk in the same halls as others to get to their seats. That is not to say that the rich are to blame in this. The middle class is just as much separated from the rich and the poor as the poor are separated from the middle class and the rich. It seems that our society is becoming increasingly consumerist. I often find that people try to find identity from what they consume more than who they are as a person. A lot of times it's been suggested that I would like or even be friends with a person simply because we both consume fashion. However fashion is not even about consumption for me. Advertising and corporations tell us we need to consume this new car or these new clothes to fit in with our demographic, regardless of what that demographic may be. Of course it is necessary that we (specifically the middle class) continue to consume from the government's point of view so that we can continue expanding the economy. Thus the government tries to provide incentive, which aside from the perceived social consequences of that, has dire environmental consequences. I find that this consumption and selling of everything, including exclusivity and stratification, drives people apart. Rather than focusing on our family, friends or community we are taught to focus on our jobs, consumption and how we curate our consumption so that we may better fit within a community of like minded consumers. For instance, just because I buy Incotext trousers, Edward Green shoes, Inverallan sweaters and Brooks Bros. ocbd's doesn't mean that I will or should be accepted into the style forum classic men's wear community. This connection you may have with someone over what you consume is superficial at best. What more can you say aside from "These sure are nice trousers, did you buy them from Barney's or Mr. Porter?" This consumerism, I feel, results in superficial connections, lack of or confusion of identity, and, as I said before, driving people apart. Not only is it just our consumerism, but our whole society that is built around consumerism. What is more isolating than a cubicle or leaving your community behind for a job? Corporations degrade community too, no longer are providers of goods and services invested in a community. When has Wal-Mart last invested in a local charity? When has Home Depot last cared about revitalizing a local neighborhood? When was the last time the owner of Best Buy heard concerns about how their store will imapct a community? It's a lot easier to ignore problems you may have a hand in causing when it's happening halfway across the country.

I think people have a lot of grief about this lack of community, they certainly aren't willing to give up smaller familial communities, just take the importance of thanksgiving or Christmas in American society for instance. People buy free trade goods, or goods that claim to give a certain percentage of the proceeds to charity. Perhaps this is in part because a sense of guilt or unfulfillment in the lack of greater community to feel that you have contributed to. Ultimately what I'm trying to say is that our increasingly consumerist society that has put a price tag on everything has resulted in the destruction a greater sense of community in America. Communities now are pitted against each other. Controversies over police violence, either at the local or national scale, often results in departments closing their ranks and protecting their members at all costs because they feel that the greater community is against all police. Often times this is true to an extent, however neither side's response is appropriate. Rich are often willing to defend other rich people no matter their moral transgressions because it seems like public opinion is against all rich people. Everyone is so polarized and offensive and I think we need to be at the exact opposite. I have recently felt a great need to extend out to communities that I have seen as separate and 'others' because I feel like we are at a point where change has to come from within ourselves. No law is going to make people hate less, no law is going to make people care about the environment more. And I don't think the solution to these problems is radical social change precipitated from a single group. This, more likely than not, will cause more friction and alienation of those outside the group. Perhaps i'm wrong or stating the obvious, but I really want to voice my opinion about community. I want to see people more involved, not just in their families or neighborhoods, but in their entire community. I want to see people extend this sense of acceptance, tolerance and family to their entire city, state, even the nation. Because, from what I've seen, people only really starts to care what happens when it is occurring at their doorstep. Pollution, crime, poverty, hunger, disease, poor education etc. is really foreign to a lot of people because they are so closed off in their community. I think it would be great if people vastly expanded their doorstep so that even though you may live in the suburbs, crime happening in the inner city is still crime happening at your doorstep. I think it would make a lot of people happier, it would improve our communities and would just improve America, and the world in general. If we all made sure that our neighbors were safe, well fed, educated and happy America would have no problems. I also think that we are starting to come to a point where community orientated grass roots movements have the potential to enact significant change. For a lot the Tea Party's initial grass roots aspect was very appealing and even though I disagree with them, I respected that aspect. I think people are getting tired of having lives centered around consumption and I think a lot of people would find pleasure in feeling a greater sense of community.

I know I have things to work on in terms of 'othering' people and hating them. Even though I may fundamentally disagree with say a Men's Rights Activist or a race realist, I have no right to hate that person or consider them less than human. Doing so only exacerbates the problem and 100% guarantees that the problem will never be solved. It also turns a blind eye to what may be things that need to be heard. Who knows? Maybe a race realist or a MRA can have some important points, it's certainly likely that they could on issues unrelated to race or gender. Perhaps people turn to MRA or race realism because they feel alienated or lost. Perhaps we can help end bigotry by taking time to walk in other's shoes instead of accusing and hating them. I'd also like to say that I'm really grateful for care-tags and that I think this is a great example of a community that cares about others and extends the size of their family to be more inclusive. I think it's awesome that I even have a place to share my ramblings. Sorry for the text wall, this really (kinda) went off topic

[zayg]

The most interesting thing about rampant consumerism to me is that there isn't some scheming group of elitists behind all of this sitting in an office laughing at the plebians. Everyone who is involved is guilty in some way. Those who are among the elites who are convincing everyone to buy their goods and services so that they may become even wealthier are simply doing what everyone else is - trying to make it in the world living the lifestyle they want to live. Of course, they end up screwing everyone else around them by doing so, but I like to feel that the maliciousness isn't out of a desire to be a shitbag, but just out of a desire to live the life they want to live. It really is a continuous cycle. I think it is easiest to realize this when you look back at history and truly realize there isn't some clear dividing line between modern society and older societies that we may consider out of touch. Our current consumerist culture came directly out of the consumerist-lite cultures of prior eras.

Trying to separate humanity and society from consumerism in my mind is as difficult as imaging how the Big Bang worked in my mind.

[Stingray Sam]

[maj]

[rublev]

[Iliam]

.

[raags]

I am scared for the inevitable backlash and kickbacks for the right wing political parties of this. I think we will see a surge in laws passing relating to data retention/surveillance/anti-immigration (although most have gone through already) and a spike in harassment towards people who fit the mold of "looking like muslims". I hope everyone who has been taken hostage gets out okay.

[nevergreen]

Wow a group of apparently seven Pakistani Taliban members attacked a school in Peshawar leaving 141 people dead, 132 of them children. This is so so sad

[rublev]

at least 11 people killed?????

:(

[spahdfgo]

Not in Paris at the moment but all my friends and family are, can't focus at all in class.

Stay safe

[sknss]

Thanks Tom. I think everyone is pretty shocked. I've seen lots of people with a copy of Charlie Hebdo in the metro. The police is everywhere too.

[eufemism]

they have a video on live leaks of the terrorists killing a wounded cop on the streets. the guy begged for his life before they shot him in the head with an AK